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Australia Northern Territory imposes strict vaccine mandates.

HiTecK said:
Latest study from PHE are saying 70% of deaths from Covid in UK hospitals are vaccinated people. That's bound to go up given the amount of people vaccinated now but that suggests the vaccine isn't working well at all for preventing deaths or transmission. Study is attached from Public Health England.

Israel introduced a third vaccination now for everyone and you are no longer classed as fully vaccinated their until you've had it. It'll be the same here soon. Are we going to continue getting vaccinated every 6 months to be allowed to work/socialise etc with these poor results and continue this alienation of others that don't want it when it's clear it's making little difference, or is it time we all stopped listening to daily fear from the media and get on with our lives.
We're in the same situation as this time last year and yet so many have had the vaccine. I won't be having anymore either way.
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Boosters etc and whats next it seems its never ending.

I have said it many times and will repeat until the day I die ALL media be it the papers, TV, radio and social media are poison who love to spread propaganda to push their narrative. They offer nothing positve to society apart from sheer negativity. Guess have to make money and drive ratings someway.
 
HiTecK said:
Both good points. 67% of the UK is fully vaccinated so a decent majority and it has brought deaths down dramatically. I shouldn't have said it wasn't working very well, it is (if they're recording deaths the same as they were pre-vaccine roll out), but my point on transmissibility stand. It's made hardly any difference (if any) and people telling others they're selfish etc, for not getting the vaccine and trying to force it on others is wrong. Same if they later try to bring vaccine passports in whilst these are the results after such high vaccine uptake.

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I have always acknowledged that the infection rate doesn't really change with vaccination, but I'm not influenced by media just the data.
Vaccination is the only real solution to sickness, fatality and hospitalizations.
My stance has not and will not change on selfishness! The only alternative is severe restrictions and that is now becoming a possibility over the next few months
 
HiTecK said:
Both good points. 67% of the UK is fully vaccinated so a decent majority and it has brought deaths down dramatically. I shouldn't have said it wasn't working very well, it is (if they're recording deaths the same as they were pre-vaccine roll out), but my point on transmissibility stand. It's made hardly any difference (if any) and people telling others they're selfish etc, for not getting the vaccine and trying to force it on others is wrong. Same if they later try to bring vaccine passports in whilst these are the results after such high vaccine uptake.

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totally agree that people should understand that the vaccine is not a cure, it will not stop this thing but when looking at case figures we have to also take into consideration there are far more tests being carried out now then there was during the last peak at the beginning of the year, kids having to test regularly, people regularly doing LFT at home etc so far more cases are going to be detected,

I still believe that having the vaccine does slow down to a degree the spread, but it does not irradicate it. I would never tell someone they are selfish for not taking it, it's their choice, but I do think vaccine passports will be used this winter and I think it's a good thing.
 
pabloescaban said:
1791 deaths in seven months of 2021.
We were having a 1000 a day in April 2020 when no one was vaccinated
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This is also back when if you died from any reason but tested positive in the last 30 days you were still a covid death. Hit by a bus but tested positive 20 days before you were put down as covid🤣

I encourage anyone who wants to get vaccinated to get it, but pushing this agenda that if you don't get it you are putting others at risk? As @HiTecK stated if you're vaccinated you should feel protected and have no worries about anyone else.
I would understand the narrative for vaccine passports if it helped eradicate the virus, but just like the flu we will have to live with it.
Protect the most vulnerable but don't make it mandatory or you will have the opposite reaction
 
jigger121 said:
This is also back when if you died from any reason but tested positive in the last 30 days you were still a covid death. Hit by a bus but tested positive 20 days before you were put down as covid🤣
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but that is still the case, deaths are reported as anyone who tested positive in the last 28 days, nothing has changed
 
grog68 said:
but that is still the case, deaths are reported as anyone who tested positive in the last 28 days, nothing has changed
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I think there's been more of a change. It has to be one of the primary factors of death. Personally I still think its not marginalised enough.

I don't think it's fair when a person's family cant get a funeral or to mourn properly because a death has been put down to covid even though they tested negatively for 20 days after and had terminal cancer(for example) . Should be put down as cancer, but it's not for some strange reason.

Also just want to say this is why I love this site, people getting to share their opinions without being nasty and we all respect what everyone says even though we might not agree👌
 
jigger121 said:
This is also back when if you died from any reason but tested positive in the last 30 days you were still a covid death. Hit by a bus but tested positive 20 days before you were put down as covid🤣

I encourage anyone who wants to get vaccinated to get it, but pushing this agenda that if you don't get it you are putting others at risk? As @HiTecK stated if you're vaccinated you should feel protected and have no worries about anyone else.
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It's obvious that vaccinated or unvaccinated has little or no effect on the spread.
So it makes no sense to vilify anyone who doesn't get jabbed, they're endangering themselves for no reason
 
pabloescaban said:
It's obvious that vaccinated or unvaccinated has little or no effect on the spread.
So it makes no sense to vilify anyone who doesn't get jabbed, they're endangering themselves for no reason
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I've noticed people going back to being careless with the vaccine. Since then people aren't washing hands, wearing masks, respecting personal spaces again because they are lulled into a false sense of security. Best way to fight this is proper hygiene and if you're sick stay home
 
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grog68 said:
we have to also take into consideration there are far more tests being carried out now then there was during the last peak at the beginning of the year, kids having to test regularly, people regularly doing LFT at home etc so far more cases are going to be detected,
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( Last peak yes) but we are in October. There were more tests being taken in March when only 3.6% of the UK were vaccinated than there are now. Its been pretty steady going forward.

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Also this peak is only just getting started. You are comparing data from highest point pre vaccine (January) to now in October.
As it stands, infection rates are higher than this time last year pre-vaccination which isn't a good advert for the vaccines transmission efficacy. We will see come January how good the vaccine is at stopping transmission. So far it doesn't look good.

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grog68 said:
but I do think vaccine passports will be used this winter and I think it's a good thing.
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If at the end of this year after 70% + of the UK is vaccinated and transmission rates are the same or worse, will you still hold that opinion that vaccine passports are a good thing and serve a purpose? To have something watching everywhere you go, who you spend time with, controlled by the Gov. I know we all have phones and if the Gov want to track us they can (if they look into it). But this will record everything you do and will be at hand to them whenever they want it and all for no reason if infection rates continue the way they're heading.
 
jigger121 said:
This is also back when if you died from any reason but tested positive in the last 30 days you were still a covid death. Hit by a bus but tested positive 20 days before you were put down as covid🤣
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This is a very good point.

Which is why I stated this in my previous statement.
HiTecK said:
(if they're recording deaths the same as they were pre-vaccine roll out), but my point on transmissibility stand.
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There's something about the way they recorded deaths here which was changed in August 2020. They were counting deaths within 60 days which was later reduced to 28 days. That doesn't explain the death toll which followed the next spike later that year. Although I don't doubt reporting deaths due to Covid or involving Covid, if that person died of something else has been relaxed to line up with the vaccine roll out to make the vaccine look better than it is but we'll never know.

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HiTecK said:
( Last peak yes) but we are in October. There were more tests being taken in March when only 3.6% of the UK were vaccinated than there are now. Its been pretty steady going forward.

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Also this peak is only just getting started. You are comparing data from highest point pre vaccine (January) to now in October.
As it stands, infection rates are higher than this time last year pre-vaccination which isn't a good advert for the vaccines transmission efficacy. We will see come January how good the vaccine is at stopping transmission. So far it doesn't look good.

View attachment 66574



If at the end of this year after 70% + of the UK is vaccinated and transmission rates are the same or worse, will you still hold that opinion that vaccine passports are a good thing and serve a purpose? To have something watching everywhere you go, who you spend time with, controlled by the Gov. I know we all have phones and if the Gov want to track us they can (if they look into it). But this will record everything you do and will be at hand to them whenever they want it and all for no reason if infection rates continue the way they're heading.
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but we was coming out of lockdown and still had restrictions in march,, early in the year we was in lockdown, we're not now so it's obvious it's going to spread more and cases are going to increase no? I am convinced that if we had no vaccine and was living unrestriced as we are now, cases would be far higher than they are now.

Even though we look at the graphs and figures and see case figures are getting as high as they where before, I think they can be misleading because of what I just said, lockdown/restrictions vs no lockdown/restrictions, really they can't be used to say how effective the vaccine has been.

I don't know how the vax passports would work, I have assumed they would work in the same way the covid pass does now for travel, show it when you need to, it doesn't log your travel etc it is just to prove your status. But again, did you never use the track and trace QR codes when you went out? that was basically tracking every where you went.
 
channelking said:
Boosters etc and whats next it seems its never ending.

I have said it many times and will repeat until the day I die ALL media be it the papers, TV, radio and social media are poison who love to spread propaganda to push their narrative. They offer nothing positve to society apart from sheer negativity. Guess have to make money and drive ratings someway.
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Completely agree CK.
The media will build people up to sell papers and then delve into their private life etc to knock them down and ruin their lives, guess what - to sell papers.
That's why they are called the Gutter Press, I just call them SCUM.
 
gravehead said:
Completely agree CK.
The media will build people up to sell papers and then delve into their private life etc to knock them down and ruin their lives, guess what - to sell papers.
That's why they are called the Gutter Press, I just call them SCUM.
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They print what sells, so the people who buy them are the problem
 
Toddy2 said:
I have always acknowledged that the infection rate doesn't really change with vaccination, but I'm not influenced by media just the data.
Vaccination is the only real solution to sickness, fatality and hospitalizations.
My stance has not and will not change on selfishness! The only alternative is severe restrictions and that is now becoming a possibility over the next few months
Click to expand...
when is the cancer cure comeing
grog68 said:
so you think without the vaccine we would be in the same possition we are now?
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how many people do you no personal have died of cv ..
 
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